Some more false information in Medieval Lands database

[Peter Stewart]

After posting recently about an invented genealogy of the early counts
of Chiny I was asked off-list to verify the origin of the counts of
Rethel and some other families in the same general - Upper Lotharingia
and Champagne - as set out in Medieval Lands.

Several generations in a few of these lineages rely almost entirely on
"Chronicon Maceriense", a notorious forgery of the late 17th or early
18th century (that was exposed as such in the 1850s).

According to the compiler, Charles Cawley, "Medieval Lands represents a
major new approach to the presentation of royal and noble families, and
the historical context in which they lived. Most existing published
works in the field have two important drawbacks. Firstly, the
information, even if the genealogies are complete, is usually limited to
dates and outlines of relationships. Secondly, there is a tendency to
copy information from previously published secondary works without
adequate verification against primary sources. This has resulted in
connections which started life as speculative being transformed into
apparent certainty, and the perpetuation of errors."

As far as it goes the last point is true, but unfortunately it applies
in spades to Cawley's own slipshod work. His basic methodology is to
skim uncritically any text in which he can make out the gist of the
Latin, assuming it to be genuine and probative unless otherwise
specified _wherever he found it_. In this case he has taken his false
"primary"source from the late 18th century secondary work _Histoire
ecclésiastique et civile du diocèse de Laon_ by Nicholas Le Long, where
it was printed in mistaken good faith.

Despite several warnings in the past some SGM participants are still
using his farrago of incompetence as a starting point and/or frequent
reference, especially for European lineages. Caveat lector.

Peter Stewart

[Margaret]

Charles Cawley also writes:-

"The author welcomes feedback, including corrections and contributions
of new, verified data. If you find any broken links or have any other
problems please report them."

Margaret

Post by Peter Stewart
After posting recently about an invented genealogy of the early counts
of Chiny I was asked off-list to verify the origin of the counts of
Rethel and some other families in the same general - Upper Lotharingia
and Champagne - as set out in Medieval Lands.
Several generations in a few of these lineages rely almost entirely on
"Chronicon Maceriense", a notorious forgery of the late 17th or early
18th century (that was exposed as such in the 1850s).
According to the compiler, Charles Cawley, "Medieval Lands represents a
major new approach to the presentation of royal and noble families, and
the historical context in which they lived.  Most existing published
works in the field have two important drawbacks.  Firstly, the
information, even if the genealogies are complete, is usually limited to
dates and outlines of relationships.  Secondly, there is a tendency to
copy information from previously published secondary works without
adequate verification against primary sources.  This has resulted in
connections which started life as speculative being transformed into
apparent certainty, and the perpetuation of errors."
As far as it goes the last point is true, but unfortunately it applies
in spades to Cawley's own slipshod work. His basic methodology is to
skim uncritically any text in which he can make out the gist of the
Latin, assuming it to be genuine and probative unless otherwise
specified _wherever he found it_. In this case he has taken his false
"primary"source from the late 18th century secondary work _Histoire
ecclésiastique et civile du diocèse de Laon_ by Nicholas Le Long, where
it was printed in mistaken good faith.
Despite several warnings in the past some SGM participants are still
using his farrago of incompetence as a starting point and/or frequent
reference, especially for European lineages. Caveat lector.
Peter Stewart

[Peter Stewart]

Post by Margaret
Charles Cawley also writes:-
"The author welcomes feedback, including corrections and contributions
of new, verified data. If you find any broken links or have any other
problems please report them."

The author doesn't begin to know his business - the whole enterprise is
a pretentious mess, not some worthy effort slightly compromised by a few
errors.

A conscientious scholar would have taken the trouble to learn the
disciplines of his field before staring work, and would survey the
literature as he went on, rather than making public the results of vain
and willfully ignorant blundering though it.

If you want to defend Medieval Lands the evidence to review is in the
database itself, not the author's self-interested request for
collaboration to improve it. He could do that himself, by trying harder.

Peter Stewart