Discussion:
Bartrum's Welsh Genealogies on-line
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John Higgins
2021-03-26 22:41:44 UTC
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Has anybody used the online version of Bartrum's Welsh Genealogies recently? The URL I have for the site (https://research.aber.ac.uk/dspace/handle/2160/4026 ) appears to no longer be working.

Thanks for any help on this.
taf
2021-03-26 23:38:49 UTC
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Has anybody used the online version of Bartrum's Welsh Genealogies recently? The URL I have for the site (https://research.aber.ac.uk/dspace/handle/2160/4026 ) appears to no longer be working.
Sometimes their server goes down, but this may be more than that - a search around the University web site turned up announcements about the project, but not the project pages as they were available.

If you want to go for broke, though, it looks like you can download the whole thing as zip files here:

https://pure.aber.ac.uk/portal/en/datasets/bartrum-genealogical-project(40837b6f-1887-4afd-9c6e-9b7e3a122693).html

taf
John Higgins
2021-03-27 00:10:49 UTC
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Post by taf
Has anybody used the online version of Bartrum's Welsh Genealogies recently? The URL I have for the site (https://research.aber.ac.uk/dspace/handle/2160/4026 ) appears to no longer be working.
Sometimes their server goes down, but this may be more than that - a search around the University web site turned up announcements about the project, but not the project pages as they were available.
https://pure.aber.ac.uk/portal/en/datasets/bartrum-genealogical-project(40837b6f-1887-4afd-9c6e-9b7e3a122693).html
taf
I think this is more than a temporary outage (which was not infrequent), as I've have the same [non-]results for a month or tow now.

And, yes, I had seen the download possibility before. :-) I may try that... A better link to it is here (at the bottom):
https://pure.aber.ac.uk/portal/en/datasets/bartrum-genealogical-project(40837b6f-1887-4afd-9c6e-9b7e3a122693).html
John Higgins
2021-03-27 00:13:30 UTC
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Post by taf
Has anybody used the online version of Bartrum's Welsh Genealogies recently? The URL I have for the site (https://research.aber.ac.uk/dspace/handle/2160/4026 ) appears to no longer be working.
Sometimes their server goes down, but this may be more than that - a search around the University web site turned up announcements about the project, but not the project pages as they were available.
https://pure.aber.ac.uk/portal/en/datasets/bartrum-genealogical-project(40837b6f-1887-4afd-9c6e-9b7e3a122693).html
taf
I think this is more than a temporary outage (which was not infrequent), as I've have the same [non-]results for a month or tow now.
https://pure.aber.ac.uk/portal/en/datasets/bartrum-genealogical-project(40837b6f-1887-4afd-9c6e-9b7e3a122693).html
Oops...the links are exactly the same - a senior moment on my part.

Thanks for your help, Todd...
taf
2021-03-27 00:23:31 UTC
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Post by John Higgins
Post by taf
https://pure.aber.ac.uk/portal/en/datasets/bartrum-genealogical-project(40837b6f-1887-4afd-9c6e-9b7e3a122693).html
Oops...the links are exactly the same - a senior moment on my part.
I think what you were intending to provide was this doi:

https://doi.org/10.20391/40837b6f-1887-4afd-9c6e-9b7e3a122693

taf
John Higgins
2021-03-27 00:38:15 UTC
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Post by taf
Post by John Higgins
Post by taf
https://pure.aber.ac.uk/portal/en/datasets/bartrum-genealogical-project(40837b6f-1887-4afd-9c6e-9b7e3a122693).html
Oops...the links are exactly the same - a senior moment on my part.
https://doi.org/10.20391/40837b6f-1887-4afd-9c6e-9b7e3a122693
taf
It seems that the last link above coverts to the previous link noted. At any rate, I'm trying that one now to see how a download works.
taf
2021-03-27 01:34:59 UTC
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Post by John Higgins
It seems that the last link above coverts to the previous link noted.
Yes, but it is simpler and should be stable - if Aberystwyth University decides to rearrange their web page addresses, the DOI will still take you to wherever they have moved the page (that is the idea at least - they do need to remember to register the change).

taf
Kathy Russell
2021-04-08 02:04:50 UTC
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Post by taf
Post by John Higgins
It seems that the last link above coverts to the previous link noted.
Yes, but it is simpler and should be stable - if Aberystwyth University decides to rearrange their web page addresses, the DOI will still take you to wherever they have moved the page (that is the idea at least - they do need to remember to register the change).
taf
Being fairly new to genealogy, I have no clue how to begin to approach this list of links. I have several Welsh ancestors and would like to be able to check what I have and build on it. Any advice?
pj.ev...@gmail.com
2021-04-08 02:42:17 UTC
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Post by Kathy Russell
Post by taf
Post by John Higgins
It seems that the last link above coverts to the previous link noted.
Yes, but it is simpler and should be stable - if Aberystwyth University decides to rearrange their web page addresses, the DOI will still take you to wherever they have moved the page (that is the idea at least - they do need to remember to register the change).
taf
Being fairly new to genealogy, I have no clue how to begin to approach this list of links. I have several Welsh ancestors and would like to be able to check what I have and build on it. Any advice?
My understanding is that Bartrum's work is mostly medieval, some into the 15th or 16th centuries, and isn't necessarily easy to follow.
taf
2021-04-08 03:46:20 UTC
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Post by ***@gmail.com
My understanding is that Bartrum's work is mostly medieval, some into the 15th or 16th centuries, and isn't necessarily easy to follow.
Bartrum's original compilation had the approximate date ranges of 300-1400 and a follow up study 1400-1500, so yes, medieval.

taf
taf
2021-04-08 03:58:59 UTC
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Post by Kathy Russell
Being fairly new to genealogy, I have no clue how to begin to approach this list of links. I have several Welsh ancestors and would like to be able to check what I have and build on it. Any advice?
If you have someone in the appropriate date range, then the place to start is the indexes.

For the period 300-1400, start with the indexes labeled WG1Ind#. If you find your person there, the listing will include a family designation and a chart number. Then find the family charts in the files Cyff_* (if the family abbreviation begins with an A, it will be in Cyff_A, if the family abbreviation begins with Rh, it will be in Cyff_Rh) and go through the charts to get to the correct chart number within the family section. Similarly within the charts links to other charts have the same format - a family abbreviation and chart number, while at the top and/or bottom of the chart is a designation of the chart that the line is continued from or to.

For the period 1400-1500, the indexes are named WG2Ind#, and the corresponding charts are Tab#. (I have never had cause to use this second series, so I am not sure of the precise arrangement, but presumably similar to the first series).

taf
John Higgins
2021-04-08 05:12:27 UTC
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Post by taf
Post by Kathy Russell
Being fairly new to genealogy, I have no clue how to begin to approach this list of links. I have several Welsh ancestors and would like to be able to check what I have and build on it. Any advice?
If you have someone in the appropriate date range, then the place to start is the indexes.
For the period 300-1400, start with the indexes labeled WG1Ind#. If you find your person there, the listing will include a family designation and a chart number. Then find the family charts in the files Cyff_* (if the family abbreviation begins with an A, it will be in Cyff_A, if the family abbreviation begins with Rh, it will be in Cyff_Rh) and go through the charts to get to the correct chart number within the family section. Similarly within the charts links to other charts have the same format - a family abbreviation and chart number, while at the top and/or bottom of the chart is a designation of the chart that the line is continued from or to.
For the period 1400-1500, the indexes are named WG2Ind#, and the corresponding charts are Tab#. (I have never had cause to use this second series, so I am not sure of the precise arrangement, but presumably similar to the first series).
taf
I've now spent a considerable amount of time looking at the zipped files for WG1 (300-1400). I've found that the Cyff_* files containing the tables appear to be VERY incomplete. (And Cyff_Rh mentioned above appears to be just garbage.) All the numbered tables appear to be there, but I can't locate the subsidiary lettered tables. For example, Bleddyn ap Cynfyn 51 is included, but not Bleddyn ap Cynfyn 51(A), 51(B), 51(C), 51(D). That's a pretty significant gap - and there are other omissions as well.

I haven't yet looked at the zipped files for WG2 (1400-1500), but I'm not hopeful that these will resolve the issue. After I do some further work (quite a bit), I'll probably send a note to the email address for the Bartrum Genealogical Project to see if I can get further information - and find out what the future of the online project is to be. At the moment I'm quite disappointed...
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