Discussion:
John Wyatt, son of Rev. Hawte Wyatt the Gateway Ancestor
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HWinnSadler
2018-03-25 20:09:40 UTC
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What is currently known about John Wyatt, the son of Reverend Hawte Wyatt by his 3rd wife, Anne Cox/Cocke? Many sources say he went to America as a headwright of Colonel Thomas Pettus, but it is uncertain if this is the son of the Reverend. There is a will in Boxley, Kent in 1656 for a John Wyatt, brother of George who died in England, but this doesn't seem to be the son of the Reverend, either. Does anyone else know anything about this son of the Reverend?
Paulo Canedo
2018-03-25 20:49:32 UTC
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Post by HWinnSadler
What is currently known about John Wyatt, the son of Reverend Hawte Wyatt by his 3rd wife, Anne Cox/Cocke? Many sources say he went to America as a headwright of Colonel Thomas Pettus, but it is uncertain if this is the son of the Reverend. There is a will in Boxley, Kent in 1656 for a John Wyatt, brother of George who died in England, but this doesn't seem to be the son of the Reverend, either. Does anyone else know anything about this son of the Reverend?
https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Wyatt-158 says: "John Wyatt , the son of Rev. Haute Wyatt and his 2nd wife Anne Cox, was cared for by his grandmother Lady Jane Finch Wyatt, as his mother had died in 1631. He came to America as a young man and was claimed as a headright by Colonel Thomas Pettus in 1652. Pettus received 1,000 acres in Westmoreland County,Virginia, in a patent dated Feb. 10, 1652, for transporting 20 persons, including John Wyatt. See Nell Marion Nugent, Cavaliers and Pioneers, Vol. 1, p. 389. John Wyatt was twice married. Around 1650 he married Mary Cocke and had sons Edmund and William. After Mary's death John married Jane Osborne and had by her a son John and daughter Anne. John Wyatt was mentioned in the will of his cousin Eleanor Wyatt, (1624-1649), the only child of Haute Wyatt's brother Henry. She died in 1649 in England and left a bequest of 40 pounds to John and 50 pounds to his sister Anne.
See "Virginia Gleanings in England," Virginia Historical Magazine 31 (1923), 239.
Anne later came to Virginia and was among the headrights claimed by John Ashley in 1653. There is a family tradition that John Wyatt, known as Capt. John Wyatt, was a sea captain and ran a line of merchant ships between England and Barbados. "Possibly Rev. Haute's son John was the Capt. John Wyatt, of York, 1646-65, at whose house in 1655 Maj. William Wyatt and others witnessed 'an acknowledgment by the protector of the young king of the Chicksoyacks to Edward Wyatt.'" See P. Stacy, "Major William Wyatt of St. Stephen's," Tyler's Quarterly Magazine 26 (October 1944), 119.
2. JOHN2 WYATT I (HAUTE1)15,16,17 was born 1630 in Boxley, Kent, England, and died Aft. 1666 in Virginia. He married (1) MARY COCKE Abt. 1650. He married (2) JANE OSBORNE18 Abt. 1653, daughter of THOMAS OSBORNE.
Notes for JANE OSBORNE:
Jane Osborne was the daughter of Captain Thomas Osborne who had come to Virginia about 1611.
Children of JOHN WYATT and MARY COCKE are:
i. EDMUND3 WYATT, b. 1651.
ii. WILLIAM WYATT, b. 1652; d. Abt. 1686; m. REBEKAH KENT.
Children of JOHN WYATT and JANE OSBORNE are:
3. iii. JOHN3 WYATT II, b. 1655, Virginia; d. Abt. 1714, Virginia.
iv. ANNE WYATT, b. 1657.".
HWinnSadler
2018-03-25 20:54:56 UTC
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This is the same source that turns up everywhere but has a few issues with it.

"Possibly Rev. Haute's son John was the Capt. John Wyatt, of York, 1646-65, at whose house in 1655 Maj. William Wyatt and others witnessed 'an acknowledgment by the protector of the young king of the Chicksoyacks to Edward Wyatt.'"

Major William Wyatt was not the son of Rev. Hawte Wyatt, or descended from him. This could point to Cpt. John Wyatt being the brother or kinsman of Major William Wyatt, and not being related to Rev. Hawte Wyatt. There doesn't seem to be any real evidence that Rev. Hawte Wyatt has descendants through his son John.
John Higgins
2018-03-25 21:55:09 UTC
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Post by HWinnSadler
This is the same source that turns up everywhere but has a few issues with it.
"Possibly Rev. Haute's son John was the Capt. John Wyatt, of York, 1646-65, at whose house in 1655 Maj. William Wyatt and others witnessed 'an acknowledgment by the protector of the young king of the Chicksoyacks to Edward Wyatt.'"
Major William Wyatt was not the son of Rev. Hawte Wyatt, or descended from him. This could point to Cpt. John Wyatt being the brother or kinsman of Major William Wyatt, and not being related to Rev. Hawte Wyatt. There doesn't seem to be any real evidence that Rev. Hawte Wyatt has descendants through his son John.
Since we're on the subject of the Wyatt family---

The immigrant Rev. Hawte Wyatt had a brother George who apparently remained in England. A line of descent from him to an English Wyatt family is shown in Miscellanea Genealogica et Heraldica, new series, 2:107 (1877).

https://archive.org/stream/miscellaneagenea02unse#page/107/mode/1up

The line leads in a few generations to George Wyatt, Chief Clerk of the Vote Office in the House of Commons (d. 1758), but there is very little information for the intervening generations including George the brother of Rev. Hawte. Is anyone familiar with this line? If so can you confirm or deny the accuracy of this descent and perhaps provide further details?
Paulo Canedo
2018-03-27 20:40:10 UTC
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Post by John Higgins
Post by HWinnSadler
This is the same source that turns up everywhere but has a few issues with it.
"Possibly Rev. Haute's son John was the Capt. John Wyatt, of York, 1646-65, at whose house in 1655 Maj. William Wyatt and others witnessed 'an acknowledgment by the protector of the young king of the Chicksoyacks to Edward Wyatt.'"
Major William Wyatt was not the son of Rev. Hawte Wyatt, or descended from him. This could point to Cpt. John Wyatt being the brother or kinsman of Major William Wyatt, and not being related to Rev. Hawte Wyatt. There doesn't seem to be any real evidence that Rev. Hawte Wyatt has descendants through his son John.
Since we're on the subject of the Wyatt family---
The immigrant Rev. Hawte Wyatt had a brother George who apparently remained in England. A line of descent from him to an English Wyatt family is shown in Miscellanea Genealogica et Heraldica, new series, 2:107 (1877).
https://archive.org/stream/miscellaneagenea02unse#page/107/mode/1up
The line leads in a few generations to George Wyatt, Chief Clerk of the Vote Office in the House of Commons (d. 1758), but there is very little information for the intervening generations including George the brother of Rev. Hawte. Is anyone familiar with this line? If so can you confirm or deny the accuracy of this descent and perhaps provide further details?
I don't see any reason for distrusting it. It appears to be trustworthy.
John Higgins
2018-03-27 23:47:36 UTC
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Post by Paulo Canedo
Post by John Higgins
Post by HWinnSadler
This is the same source that turns up everywhere but has a few issues with it.
"Possibly Rev. Haute's son John was the Capt. John Wyatt, of York, 1646-65, at whose house in 1655 Maj. William Wyatt and others witnessed 'an acknowledgment by the protector of the young king of the Chicksoyacks to Edward Wyatt.'"
Major William Wyatt was not the son of Rev. Hawte Wyatt, or descended from him. This could point to Cpt. John Wyatt being the brother or kinsman of Major William Wyatt, and not being related to Rev. Hawte Wyatt. There doesn't seem to be any real evidence that Rev. Hawte Wyatt has descendants through his son John.
Since we're on the subject of the Wyatt family---
The immigrant Rev. Hawte Wyatt had a brother George who apparently remained in England. A line of descent from him to an English Wyatt family is shown in Miscellanea Genealogica et Heraldica, new series, 2:107 (1877).
https://archive.org/stream/miscellaneagenea02unse#page/107/mode/1up
The line leads in a few generations to George Wyatt, Chief Clerk of the Vote Office in the House of Commons (d. 1758), but there is very little information for the intervening generations including George the brother of Rev. Hawte. Is anyone familiar with this line? If so can you confirm or deny the accuracy of this descent and perhaps provide further details?
I don't see any reason for distrusting it. It appears to be trustworthy.
I repeat: there are no sources given for this pedigree. What exactly is your basis for saying that "it appears to be trustworthy"? The fact that it was published in "Miscellanea Genealogica et Heraldica" does not automatically make it credible.

As a start, look at the chronology for the descent that I've mentioned (with some notes added):

1. George Wyatt (bur. 1 Sept 1623) [actually, per RPA, b. 1550, bur. 1624, not 1623]
2. George Wyatt (d. 1624) [perhaps confused with his father?]
3. George Wyatt [no dates given - supposed brother Thomas possibly bur. 1625]
4. John Wyatt (d. 6 June 1728 aged 56) [therefore born ca. 1672]

According to this chronology, the third George Wyatt must have born no later than 1624 (when his father died). But that would make him at least 48 when his son John was born. Not impossible - but rather late to be a father given the trend in this family. And the lack of supportable dates or other information for the second and third Georges should be a warning flag about the validity of this line.

I think this line needs better support before it can be considered to be valid.
John Higgins
2020-01-05 01:01:09 UTC
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Post by John Higgins
Since we're on the subject of the Wyatt family---
The immigrant Rev. Hawte Wyatt had a brother George who apparently remained in England. A line of descent from him to an English Wyatt family is shown in Miscellanea Genealogica et Heraldica, new series, 2:107 (1877).
https://archive.org/stream/miscellaneagenea02unse#page/107/mode/1up
The line leads in a few generations to George Wyatt, Chief Clerk of the Vote Office in the House of Commons (d. 1758), but there is very little information for the intervening generations including George the brother of Rev. Hawte. Is anyone familiar with this line? If so can you confirm or deny the accuracy of this descent and perhaps provide further details?
Back in March 2018 I raised a question (above) about a supposed descent from George Wyatt (brother of Rev. Hawte) and his wife Jane Finch to George Wyatt, Chief Clerk of the Vote Office in the House of Commons (d. 1758). The descent, published in the MGH issue cited above, goes as follows:

George Wyatt; m. Jane Finch
George Wyatt (d. 1624)
George Wyatt
John Wyat (d. 1728); m. Elizabeth Browne
George Wyatt, Chief Clerk of the Vote Office (d. 1758); m. Hannah Wood

I've now found evidence that appears to conclusively disprove this line. David M. Loades, "The Papers of George Wyatt" (1968) states on pages 12-13 that George, the son of George Wyatt and Jane Finch, d. of a fever in 1619 aged 17 - and unmarried. This is based on the parish records of Boxley. Thus, no descendants...

Loades speculates that the descendants (including John Wyat and George Wyatt) assigned wrongly (by the MGH article and other publications) to the younger George Wyatt might be descended from his brother Rev. Henry Wyatt. But he makes it clear that this is simply speculative, and I've seen no good evidence of any descents from Rev. Henry.
John Higgins
2020-01-05 01:06:01 UTC
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Post by John Higgins
Since we're on the subject of the Wyatt family---
The immigrant Rev. Hawte Wyatt had a brother George who apparently remained in England. A line of descent from him to an English Wyatt family is shown in Miscellanea Genealogica et Heraldica, new series, 2:107 (1877).
https://archive.org/stream/miscellaneagenea02unse#page/107/mode/1up
The line leads in a few generations to George Wyatt, Chief Clerk of the Vote Office in the House of Commons (d. 1758), but there is very little information for the intervening generations including George the brother of Rev. Hawte. Is anyone familiar with this line? If so can you confirm or deny the accuracy of this descent and perhaps provide further details?
This should have read "George Wyatt (brother of Rev. Hawte), SON OF GEORGE WYATT and his wife Jane Finch".
HWinnSadler
2018-03-26 02:04:00 UTC
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Wikitree has a link to George, son of Sir George and brother of Rev. Hawte and Sir Francis Wyatt, but gives no other information on him. https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Wyatt-371
John Higgins
2018-03-26 03:18:56 UTC
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Post by HWinnSadler
Wikitree has a link to George, son of Sir George and brother of Rev. Hawte and Sir Francis Wyatt, but gives no other information on him. https://www.wikitree.com/wiki/Wyatt-371
Yes, I had seen that...
HWinnSadler
2018-03-26 03:37:23 UTC
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While I can't be certain, and more research should be conducted, I personally think the pedigree is probably solid. Do you descend from George Wyatt, Chief Clerk of the Vote Office in the House of Commons (d. 1758)?
John Higgins
2018-03-26 03:54:21 UTC
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Post by HWinnSadler
While I can't be certain, and more research should be conducted, I personally think the pedigree is probably solid. Do you descend from George Wyatt, Chief Clerk of the Vote Office in the House of Commons (d. 1758)?
I don't descend from this George Wyatt, but a close friend of mine does - via George's youngest daughter Hannah who married Very Rev. William Vincent, Dean of Westminster (d. 1815).
HWinnSadler
2018-03-27 13:19:56 UTC
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The Genealogy seems to be from a credible source, I'd support it.
John Higgins
2018-03-27 15:39:33 UTC
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Post by HWinnSadler
The Genealogy seems to be from a credible source, I'd support it.
Since no source at all is given for the pedigree, it's hard to see how it can be judged to be "from a credible source". The lack of sources is one reason why I'm looking for better information on the family.
HWinnSadler
2018-03-27 20:02:00 UTC
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I said it seems like a credible source, because I've heard that "Miscellanea Genealogica et Heraldica" is credible.
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