Discussion:
New American gateway ancestor – Susanna Reeve
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Jane Alexander
2013-04-18 20:37:23 UTC
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I am submitting the following line of descent to the forum for help in
confirming or refuting the following line of descent from William the
Conqueror to Susanna Reeve, who immigrated to Virginia and married Gillee
Gromarrin. Gillee Gromarrin was a major land holder in Henrico County,
Virginia. Gillee’s will is dated 16 Oct 1716, and probated 5 Nov 1716.

Thank you for your assistance,

Jane A. "Xan" Alexander


Line of Descent from William the Conqueror to Eleanor Pabenham to Susanna
Reeve

1) William the Conqueror (abt 1028 – 9 Sept 1087) and wife Matilda of
Flanders (abt 1031 – 2 Nov 1083)

2) King Henry I of England (abt 1068 – 1 Dec 1135) and mistress

3) Robert FitzRoy, Earl of Gloucester (d. 31 Oct 1147) & wife Mabel,
Countess of Gloucester (1090 – 29 Sept 1157)

4) Maud FitzRobert (d. 29 July 1189) & Ranulf de Gernon, Earl of Chester (
1099 – 1153)

5) Hugh de Kevelioc, Earl of Chester ( 1147 – 30 Jun 1181) and first wife

6) Amice / Amicia of Chester and husband Ralph de Mainwaring

7) Bertrad de Mainwaring and husband Henry de Audley (d. bef Nov 1246)

8) Alice de Audley and husband Peter / Piers de Montfort (d. 4 Aug 1265)

9) Piers / Peter II de Montfort and wife Matilda de la Mare

10) Elizabeth de Montfort and husband William de Montagu / Monte Acuto /
Montacute

11) Alice Montacute and husband Ralph Daubeney

12) Giles Daubeney and wife Eleanor de Wylyngton / Welyton / Wyllington

13) Joan Daubeneye / Dawbeny and her husband Lawrence Pabenham, knight (d.
1399)

14) Eleanor Pabenham and husband John Teringham / Tyringham

15) John Teringham & daughter of Sir Geoffrey Lucy (from Visitation of
Suffolk)

16) younger son Teringham & daughter of Sir William Chamberleyn (from
Visitation of Suffolk)

17) Teringham & daughter of Bardwell (from Visitation of Suffolk)

18) Mary Teringham and husband John Heigham (from Visitation of Suffolk –
Heigham family)

19) Elizabeth Heigham and husband Thomas Armiger (from Visitation of
Suffolk – Heigham family & Armiger family)

20) Thomas Armiger & wife Jane Eyre (from Visitation of Suffolk – Armiger
family)

21) Rose / Rhose Armiger & husband William Reve, gent. (from Visitation of
Essex – Reve family)

There may be one more Thomas Armiger generation between gen 20 & 21

22) Robert Reve, parson of Wrestlingworth

23) Robert Reve of Romford

24) John Reeve

25) Susanna Reeve immigrated to Virginia along with brother Francis Reeve.
She married Gillee Gromarrin. She is listed in her father John Reeve’s
will and in her brother Wiltshire Reeve’s will.


*Supporting Evidence: *

The will of “John Reeve of the parish of havering Lee Bower in the Countie
of Essex Gentleman” is dated 7 Nov 1693. In his will, he lists the
following children: Wiltshier, Francis, Susana, Ann, and Letitia.


(Susanna’s brother) Wiltshire Reeve’s will is published in The New York
Genealogical and Biographical Record, Volume 43, pages 69-70. The will of
“Wiltshire Reeve the elder, of Hubbard’s Hall in the parish of Harlow, co.
Essex, gent.” is dated 13 Sept 1704, proved 1 Dec 1707, and includes “also
I doe give and devise all my plantations, lands, tenements, etc. at or neer
James River or elsewhere in Virginia in the parts beyond the seas, unto my
sister Susan, now Susan Mareen, now or late residing in Virginia, and to
her heirs for ever.” Wiltshire also lists his sisters Letitia Wickstead
and Anne Spademan.
From Tidewater Virginia Families: A Magazine of History and Genealogy,
Volume 6 Number 4, page 221:

"*1 Aug 1698 Francis Reeve (II) signs a pledge to give an annuity of 10
pounds for every year after 1703 during the life of Susannah Marrin, which
was give to her by her decd father, John Reeve, and to pay 90 pounds to
her on Oct 31 1703; if she dies before 1703, Gilly Grooma Marrin will
release him from payment. (footnote: Weisiger, Henrico Deeds, (1):104."
From the Visitation of Essex – Reve family: John Reeve’s great uncle
Francis Reve owned Hubbard Hall, thus tieing Susana’s brother Wiltshire
Reve to the Reve family given in the Visitation.


Visitation of Essex – Reve family

http://archive.org/stream/visitationsofess1314metc#page/274/mode/2up<http://archive.org/stream/visitationsofess1314metc%22%20%5Cl%20%22page/274/mode/2up>-
1612

http://archive.org/stream/visitationsofess1314metc#page/476/mode/2up<http://archive.org/stream/visitationsofess1314metc%22%20%5Cl%20%22page/476/mode/2up>-
1634


Visitation of Suffolk

http://archive.org/stream/visitationsofsuf00harvuoft#page/108/mode/2up<http://archive.org/stream/visitationsofsuf00harvuoft%22%20%5Cl%20%22page/108/mode/2up>-
Armiger family


Visitation of Suffolk part 2
http://books.google.com/books?id=6BoaAAAAIAAJ&pg=PA212#v=onepage&q&f=false<http://books.google.com/books?id=6BoaAAAAIAAJ&pg=PA212%22%20%5Cl%20%22v=onepage&q&f=false>

- Heigham Pedigree, including Teringham back to Pabenham, also lists
Elizabeth, daughter of John Heigham & Mary Teringham, married to Thomas
Armiger
Johnny Brananas
2013-04-18 21:47:51 UTC
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I guess the equivalence of the name Marrin to Gromarrin is
established. At least I see mention, looking through Google Books, of
a man living in Virginia called Wiltshire "Marrin" (Gromarrin). I
suppose he was named after his uncle (or great-uncle) Wiltshire Reeve
of Hubbard's Hall in Harlow, Essex:

http://books.google.com/books?id=LG8bAQAAMAAJ&q=%22wiltshire+marrin%22&dq=%22wiltshire+marrin%22&hl=en&sa=X&ei=z11wUbTJE5GI9gT7z4HICQ&ved=0CC8Q6AEwAA

Also, there is mention of a Gilly Marrin, deceased in 1757, who had a
son Wiltshire Marrin:

http://books.google.com/books?id=oV1PAAAAMAAJ&q=%22wiltshire+marrin%22&dq=%22wiltshire+marrin%22&hl=en&sa=X&ei=z11wUbTJE5GI9gT7z4HICQ&ved=0CEcQ6AEwBA

So ... it does look like Gromarrin could be the same as Marrin.

It seems that Hubbard's Hall, in Harlow, Essex, the place of residence
of Susanna Gromarrin/ Marrin's brother Wiltshire Reeve, came into the
Reeve family by 1634 and was held by them up to 1723.

http://www.google.com/search?tbm=bks&hl=en&q=hubbards+hall+reeve&btnG=#q=hubbards+hall+reeve&hl=en&tbm=bks&psj=1&ei=pl5wUevFAYjA9QSjlIDoDw&start=10&sa=N&bav=on.2,or.r_qf.&bvm=bv.45373924,d.eWU&fp=f9463dcea583726a&biw=1280&bih=866

Therefore, Wiltshire Reeve and his sister Susan may be descendants of
Francis Reeve of Hubbard's Hall, who married Joan Jocelyn ...

http://books.google.com/books?id=0m1KAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA477&dq=harlowe+francis+reeve&hl=en&sa=X&ei=LWFwUeWEN4Os9ASB4YHICQ&ved=0CGkQ6AEwCQ#v=onepage&q=harlowe%20francis%20reeve&f=false

... unless there is some reason to assign them to the other branch who
went through the minister of Bedfordshire and descendants in Romford,
Essex.

You may have to do some original research to link them firmly to the
Hubbard's Hall branch, but it might "pay off" in a better royal
descent. It looks to me like the grandparents of Joan (Jocelyn)
Reeve, wife of Francis Reeve who owned Hubbard's Hall in 1634, were
Sir Thomas Jocelyn and Dorothy Gates, and her parents were Richard
Jocelyn and Anne Lucas.

http://books.google.com/books?id=JyjvAAAAMAAJ&pg=PA430&dq=richard+jocelyn+lucas&hl=en&sa=X&ei=0WJwUcLTAouG9QTM7oGgBw&ved=0CEYQ6AEwAg#v=onepage&q=richard%20jocelyn%20lucas&f=false

Anne Lucas, wife of Richard Jocelyn, may be descended from the Jermyn
family:

http://books.google.com/books?id=knVPAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA515&dq=%22thomas+lucas%22+jocelyn&hl=en&sa=X&ei=HWNwUaWvNoPE9gT5yoHoDw&ved=0CD0Q6AEwAg#v=onepage&q=%22thomas%20lucas%22%20jocelyn&f=false

There may be "better" royal descents through these people (Jocelyn/
Jermyn/ Lucas / Gates), if you can establish the correct line back to
them.
Johnny Brananas
2013-04-18 22:30:03 UTC
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http://archiver.rootsweb.ancestry.com/th/read/HUGUENOT-WALLOON/2006-10/1161550672
Hal Bradley
2013-04-18 22:39:38 UTC
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Jane, John,

Anne Lucas has a probable descent from John "Lackland", King of England
through the Lucas/Gedding family. Though she has Jermyn ancestry, there does
not appear to be any royal connections behind it.

Hal Bradley
-----Original Message-----
Sent: Thursday, April 18, 2013 2:48 PM
Subject: Re: New American gateway ancestor - Susanna Reeve
<<Snip>>
Anne Lucas, wife of Richard Jocelyn, may be descended from the Jermyn
http://books.google.com/books?id=knVPAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA515&dq=%22thomas+luc
as%22+jocelyn&hl=en&sa=X&ei=HWNwUaWvNoPE9gT5yoHoDw&ved=0CD0Q6AEwAg#v=on
epage&q=%22thomas%20lucas%22%20jocelyn&f=false
There may be "better" royal descents through these people (Jocelyn/
Jermyn/ Lucas / Gates), if you can establish the correct line back to
them.
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04/15/13
Jane Alexander
2013-04-18 22:42:24 UTC
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The Visitations of Essex in 1634
http://archive.org/stream/visitationsofess1314metc#page/476/mode/2up
states "Francis Reeve of Huberts-Hall in Harlow co. Essex gent. aged about
73 yeares & hath lived w'th Joane his wife she being dau. of Richard
Jocelin son & heire Sr Thomas Jocelin Knt. of the bath he & she are living
ao 1634." This pedigree does not show them having any children.

I have been trying to get a copy of Francis' will. I have seen one
reference in a forum discussion that his heir was his nephew Robert. Since
Hubbard Hall is the property of Wiltshire Reeve, son of John Reeve &
brother of Susanna Reeve Gromarrin, I assigned Susanna's line to the John
s/o Robert s/o Robert s/o William Reve line.


On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 5:47 PM, Johnny Brananas
Post by Johnny Brananas
It seems that Hubbard's Hall, in Harlow, Essex, the place of residence
of Susanna Gromarrin/ Marrin's brother Wiltshire Reeve, came into the
Reeve family by 1634 and was held by them up to 1723.
Therefore, Wiltshire Reeve and his sister Susan may be descendants of
Francis Reeve of Hubbard's Hall, who married Joan Jocelyn ...
... unless there is some reason to assign them to the other branch who
went through the minister of Bedfordshire and descendants in Romford,
Essex.
Johnny Brananas
2013-04-18 23:01:20 UTC
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The Visitations of Essex in 1634http://archive.org/stream/visitationsofess1314metc#page/476/mode/2up
states "Francis Reeve of Huberts-Hall in Harlow co. Essex gent. aged about
73 yeares & hath lived w'th Joane his wife she being dau. of Richard
Jocelin son & heire Sr Thomas Jocelin Knt. of the bath he & she are living
ao 1634."   This pedigree does not show them having any children.
I have been trying to get a copy of Francis' will.  I have seen one
reference in a forum discussion that his heir was his nephew Robert.  Since
Hubbard Hall is the property of Wiltshire Reeve, son of John Reeve &
brother of Susanna Reeve Gromarrin, I assigned Susanna's line to the John
s/o Robert s/o Robert s/o William Reve line.
It's probably best to sort out this part of the line first, before
going further back. Although it seems there would be gentry lines,
and possibly some royal ones.

This source gives a different parentage for Joan Jocelyn, wife of
Reeve.

http://books.google.com/books?id=WNMqAQAAIAAJ&pg=PA360&dq=%22francis+reeve%22+heir&hl=en&sa=X&ei=MHpwUc6zPIaK9QSu4IHwDQ&ved=0CF0Q6AEwBw#v=onepage&q=%22francis%20reeve%22%20heir&f=false
Johnny Brananas
2013-04-18 23:12:09 UTC
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Yes, it does look as though Francis Reve (m. Joan Jocelyn) left no
issue:

http://books.google.com/books?id=fw7OAAAAMAAJ&pg=PA137&dq=%22francis+reve%22+essex&hl=en&sa=X&ei=uXxwUcSGDo6-9QThwoGgBQ&ved=0CD0Q6AEwAg#v=onepage&q=%22francis%20reve%22%20essex&f=false

The thing to do now is to determine the correct descent of the
property called Hubbard's Hall down to Wiltshire Reeve. Since his own
father John was "of Havering at Bower," not Harlow, in his will,
perhaps he (John) did not have possession of Hubbard's Hall. It is
definitely the right family, though.
Jane Alexander
2013-04-18 23:25:47 UTC
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Below is the will of John Reeve, as best I could transcribe it. In the
will, part of what he leaves to Wiltshier is "eight acres be they more or
less lyeing in (?) of Harlowe in the said County of Essex Together" Although
John never specifically names Hubbard Hall, that may be what he is
referring to, since Hubbard Hall is located just outside Harlow co. Essex.
----------

Transcription of the Will of John Reeve


In the Name of God Amen the

Seaventh(?) day of November in the yeere of our Lord God one thoushand

six hundred ninety and three I *John Reeve* of the parish of ~

havering Lee Bower in the Countie of Essex Gentleman being

weake in body but of Sound and perfect mine and memory praise

be therefore given to Almightie God I do make and ordain this

my present last will and Testament in manner and forme following

that is to say First and principally I commend my Soule into

the hands of Almightie God hopeing through the merits (?)

and passion of my Saviour Jesus Christ to have full and free

forgiveness of all my Sins and to inherit everlastinge life and

my body I commit to the Earth to be buried at the discretion

of my Executor hereafter named and as (pertaininge?) the disposition

of such fouiporall estate as it hath pleased Almightie God to

bestowe upon me I give, devise and dispose thereof as followeth

Item I give and bequeath unto *Elizabeth* my loving wife all

the money that shall be {from her (?) } due to me at my ce(?)se and give ***

daughter {blurry} Barrington widow late wife of John

Barrington Esquier deseased Item I alsoe give & bequeath

unto the said Elizabeth my wife the Sume of fouretie pounds


[next page]

of good and lawfull money cleerly(?) without paying(?)

any Taxes to be paid to her yeerly and everie yeere during her (?)

life by my Executor hereafternamed and I order that Twenty

pounds being pre(?) of payment of the fourtie(?) pounds for the (?)

to her, within six days next after my decease and

the other twentie pounds within one yeere next ensueing after

the said six dayes; and afterwards Soe on such (?) of payment

dureing her life I alsoe give to the said *Elizabeth my wife* the

Turkey worke Couch and all the Turkey worke Chaires, and I alsoe

order that all these goods the said *Elizabeth my wife* brought

with her, at her intermarriage with me, be forthwithe delivered

to her after my decease upon her demand I alsoe give to the sd

*Elizabeth my wife*, my Coach and two of my best horses, which

she shall please to make choice off, with the Coach harness

furniture, I alsoe order that what things be in a (?) or (?)

which are in my *Cousin Haynes* hand after(?) ****

the said Elizabeth my wife after my decease, with my other

household (?) , she shall desire, the Coppers onely excepted

Item I give and bequeath unto my *daughter Susana Reeve*

the Sume of Ten pounds Currant English money to be paid

to her yeerely and everie yeere during her natural life by

my *son Ffrancis Reeve* or his (?eires) the first payment thereof

to begin, and ot be made within Twelve monthees after my decease

and my minde(?) and will is that the said *ffrancis Reeve my sone*

shall enter into sifticient bond to the said *Susanna* for the

sure payment of her said yearly annuity of Ten pounds &

he putting in such security as aforesaid I will and order that

my Executor hereafter named of the time of giving such a

security shall acquit release and discharge my said sonne

*ffrancis Reeve* of one obligation made from him to me conditional

for the payment of Three hundred pounds that will be (dist?)

to my Executor three months next after my decease, (officially?)

the same obligaton to be in full force Item I give to my

said *son ffrancis Reeve* one new suite of Apparell that I

bought at Mid(?) Gilanous(?) the last yeere never worne & six

[next page]

paire of shoes with it Item I given unto *daughter Ann *

*Reeve* the sume of ffourtie pounds of good and lawfull money

of England to be paid to her Tenn pound every (quarter?)

of a yeare yearly di(risty?) (?) (?) my (?)

Executor the first prin(?) thereof to begin and to be (?)

within three monthes next after my desease, And my (?) a and

will is that my said Executor shall enter into sufficient

bond to the said Ann Reeve my daughter for the said(?) pay-

ment of (houstaid?) yeerely annuity of ffourtie pounds Item

I give and bequeath unto my daughter Anne Reeve (?)

five pounds a yeere and everie yeere, Currant English money

to be paid to her yeerely until the expiration of two yeeres

next ensueing after the desease of (Mis?) (Parire?), not to her (own?)

use, but to be disposed by her to buy clothes for the children of *her*

*sister Letitia* or otherwise as she shall think best (?)

for her said sister Letitia Item I will (?) devise unto

my *son Wiltshier Reeve* (All?) those (?)

the name of Longtrost(?) or by any other name (?) by

ostinacon eight acres be they more or less lyeing in (?)

of Harlowe in the said County of Essex Together with all ()

other my said Dist(?) Tenements and Lands with Goods

with (?) of Situate lyeing and being in (?) (?)

aforesaid and alsoe all my (houses?) and Tenements whatsoever

with (?) of Sictuate and being in (?) old broad oaks

in the said Countie and alsoe all my (?) and (?)

whatsoever with (?) Situate and being in (?)

parish of Bar(?) in the said Countie with all the (?) be-

longing to the (?)

all my


to hold unto the (?) and b(?) of (?) the said Wilshire

Reeve my sonne and to his heires and assignes for ever

absolutely without any condition And I make and ordaine

the said Wilthsire Reeve my son to be my full and sole

[next page]

Executor of this my last will and Testament In witness

whereof I the said John Reeve the Testator have herewith

sett my hand and seale the day and yeare above written

John Reeve signed sealed published and deshaed(?) by the

Testator in the presence of (?) John Serille(?) the marks of

Jeames King, Ex

Probatum fuit ***

month January Anno (?) 1693 ***





On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 7:12 PM, Johnny Brananas
Post by Johnny Brananas
Yes, it does look as though Francis Reve (m. Joan Jocelyn) left no
http://books.google.com/books?id=fw7OAAAAMAAJ&pg=PA137&dq=%22francis+reve%22+essex&hl=en&sa=X&ei=uXxwUcSGDo6-9QThwoGgBQ&ved=0CD0Q6AEwAg#v=onepage&q=%22francis%20reve%22%20essex&f=false
The thing to do now is to determine the correct descent of the
property called Hubbard's Hall down to Wiltshire Reeve. Since his own
father John was "of Havering at Bower," not Harlow, in his will,
perhaps he (John) did not have possession of Hubbard's Hall. It is
definitely the right family, though.
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To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to
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Johnny Brananas
2013-04-18 23:29:32 UTC
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The 1639 will of Francis Reeve starts on p. 359 of this source:

http://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=uc1.b3084501;view=1up;seq=547;q1=mounden;start=1;size=10;page=search;num=359
Johnny Brananas
2013-04-18 23:42:39 UTC
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http://books.google.com/books?id=PzPfIuEk4LoC&pg=PA150&dq=%22john+reeve%22+harlow&hl=en&sa=X&ei=noRwUZGIDorU9QT6xYHQAg&ved=0CGEQ6AEwCTgU#v=onepage&q=%22john%20reeve%22%20harlow&f=false
Johnny Brananas
2013-04-18 23:50:05 UTC
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Her first husband was probably a member of the Dawges/ Dauges family
of Loughton/ Lowton, Essex:

https://www.google.com/search?tbm=bks&hl=en&q=dawges+loughton&btnG=
Wjhonson
2013-04-18 22:45:11 UTC
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Deed DR5/1192 11 November 1674


These documents are held at Shakespeare Centre Library and Archive



Paper 7¾ x 8½ in. Damaged by rodents


Contents:
Receipt from George Smith to Francis Reeve, through his son Richard Reeve for £39 10s. being the purchase money for Shepheards tenement and garden [in Sambourn].






Francis Reeve of Huberts-Hall







-----Original Message-----
From: Jane Alexander <***@gmail.com>
To: Johnny Brananas <***@yahoo.com>
Cc: gen-medieval <gen-***@rootsweb.com>
Sent: Thu, Apr 18, 2013 3:42 pm
Subject: Re: New American gateway ancestor – Susanna Reeve


The Visitations of Essex in 1634
http://archive.org/stream/visitationsofess1314metc#page/476/mode/2up
states "Francis Reeve of Huberts-Hall in Harlow co. Essex gent. aged about
73 yeares & hath lived w'th Joane his wife she being dau. of Richard
Jocelin son & heire Sr Thomas Jocelin Knt. of the bath he & she are living
ao 1634." This pedigree does not show them having any children.

I have been trying to get a copy of Francis' will. I have seen one
reference in a forum discussion that his heir was his nephew Robert. Since
Hubbard Hall is the property of Wiltshire Reeve, son of John Reeve &
brother of Susanna Reeve Gromarrin, I assigned Susanna's line to the John
s/o Robert s/o Robert s/o William Reve line.


On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 5:47 PM, Johnny Brananas
Post by Johnny Brananas
It seems that Hubbard's Hall, in Harlow, Essex, the place of residence
of Susanna Gromarrin/ Marrin's brother Wiltshire Reeve, came into the
Reeve family by 1634 and was held by them up to 1723.
Therefore, Wiltshire Reeve and his sister Susan may be descendants of
Francis Reeve of Hubbard's Hall, who married Joan Jocelyn ...
... unless there is some reason to assign them to the other branch who
went through the minister of Bedfordshire and descendants in Romford,
Essex.
-------------------------------
To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to GEN-MEDIEVAL-***@rootsweb.com
with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of
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Wjhonson
2013-04-18 22:49:41 UTC
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Transactions of the Essex Archaeological Society - Page 360
Charles Reeve, my nephew George Rentes sonne, Francis Reeve, my godson, sonne of George Reeve, younger. W- Reeve, of Writtell. Testator's Mannor and lands of Hubbards Hall.






-----Original Message-----
From: Jane Alexander <***@gmail.com>
To: Johnny Brananas <***@yahoo.com>
Cc: gen-medieval <gen-***@rootsweb.com>
Sent: Thu, Apr 18, 2013 3:42 pm
Subject: Re: New American gateway ancestor – Susanna Reeve


The Visitations of Essex in 1634
http://archive.org/stream/visitationsofess1314metc#page/476/mode/2up
states "Francis Reeve of Huberts-Hall in Harlow co. Essex gent. aged about
73 yeares & hath lived w'th Joane his wife she being dau. of Richard
Jocelin son & heire Sr Thomas Jocelin Knt. of the bath he & she are living
ao 1634." This pedigree does not show them having any children.

I have been trying to get a copy of Francis' will. I have seen one
reference in a forum discussion that his heir was his nephew Robert. Since
Hubbard Hall is the property of Wiltshire Reeve, son of John Reeve &
brother of Susanna Reeve Gromarrin, I assigned Susanna's line to the John
s/o Robert s/o Robert s/o William Reve line.


On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 5:47 PM, Johnny Brananas
Post by Johnny Brananas
It seems that Hubbard's Hall, in Harlow, Essex, the place of residence
of Susanna Gromarrin/ Marrin's brother Wiltshire Reeve, came into the
Reeve family by 1634 and was held by them up to 1723.
Therefore, Wiltshire Reeve and his sister Susan may be descendants of
Francis Reeve of Hubbard's Hall, who married Joan Jocelyn ...
... unless there is some reason to assign them to the other branch who
went through the minister of Bedfordshire and descendants in Romford,
Essex.
-------------------------------
To unsubscribe from the list, please send an email to GEN-MEDIEVAL-***@rootsweb.com
with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of
the message
John Higgins
2013-04-18 23:45:18 UTC
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Post by Wjhonson
Transactions of the Essex Archaeological Society - Page 360
Charles Reeve, my nephew George Rentes sonne, Francis Reeve, my godson, sonne of George Reeve, younger. W- Reeve, of Writtell. Testator's Mannor and lands of Hubbards Hall.
-----Original Message-----
Sent: Thu, Apr 18, 2013 3:42 pm
Subject: Re: New American gateway ancestor – Susanna Reeve
The Visitations of Essex in 1634http://archive.org/stream/visitationsofess1314metc#page/476/mode/2up
states "Francis Reeve of Huberts-Hall in Harlow co. Essex gent. aged about
73 yeares & hath lived w'th Joane his wife she being dau. of Richard
Jocelin son & heire Sr Thomas Jocelin Knt. of the bath he & she are living
ao 1634."   This pedigree does not show them having any children.
I have been trying to get a copy of Francis' will.  I have seen one
reference in a forum discussion that his heir was his nephew Robert.  Since
Hubbard Hall is the property of Wiltshire Reeve, son of John Reeve &
brother of Susanna Reeve Gromarrin, I assigned Susanna's line to the John
s/o Robert s/o Robert s/o William Reve line.
On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 5:47 PM, Johnny Brananas
Post by Johnny Brananas
It seems that Hubbard's Hall, in Harlow, Essex, the place of residence
of Susanna Gromarrin/ Marrin's brother Wiltshire Reeve, came into the
Reeve family by 1634 and was held by them up to 1723.
Therefore, Wiltshire Reeve and his sister Susan may be descendants of
Francis Reeve of Hubbard's Hall, who married Joan Jocelyn ...
... unless there is some reason to assign them to the other branch who
went through the minister of Bedfordshire and descendants in Romford,
Essex.
-------------------------------
with the word 'unsubscribe' without the quotes in the subject and the body of
the message
Which volume of TEAS?
Wjhonson
2013-04-19 00:01:56 UTC
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https://www.google.com/search?q="francis+reeve"+hubbards#q="francis+reeve"+hubbards&source=lnms&tbm=bks






-----Original Message-----
From: John Higgins <***@yahoo.com>
To: gen-medieval <gen-***@rootsweb.com>
Sent: Thu, Apr 18, 2013 4:56 pm
Subject: Re: New American gateway ancestor – Susanna Reeve
Post by Wjhonson
Transactions of the Essex Archaeological Society - Page 360
Charles Reeve, my nephew George Rentes sonne, Francis Reeve, my godson, sonne
of George Reeve, younger. W- Reeve, of Writtell. Testator's Mannor and lands of
Hubbards Hall.
Post by Wjhonson
-----Original Message-----
Sent: Thu, Apr 18, 2013 3:42 pm
Subject: Re: New American gateway ancestor – Susanna Reeve
The Visitations of Essex in 1634http://archive.org/stream/visitationsofess1314metc#page/476/mode/2up
states "Francis Reeve of Huberts-Hall in Harlow co. Essex gent. aged about
73 yeares & hath lived w'th Joane his wife she being dau. of Richard
Jocelin son & heire Sr Thomas Jocelin Knt. of the bath he & she are living
ao 1634." This pedigree does not show them having any children.
I have been trying to get a copy of Francis' will. I have seen one
reference in a forum discussion that his heir was his nephew Robert. Since
Hubbard Hall is the property of Wiltshire Reeve, son of John Reeve &
brother of Susanna Reeve Gromarrin, I assigned Susanna's line to the John
s/o Robert s/o Robert s/o William Reve line.
On Thu, Apr 18, 2013 at 5:47 PM, Johnny Brananas
Post by Johnny Brananas
It seems that Hubbard's Hall, in Harlow, Essex, the place of residence
of Susanna Gromarrin/ Marrin's brother Wiltshire Reeve, came into the
Reeve family by 1634 and was held by them up to 1723.
Therefore, Wiltshire Reeve and his sister Susan may be descendants of
Francis Reeve of Hubbard's Hall, who married Joan Jocelyn ...
... unless there is some reason to assign them to the other branch who
went through the minister of Bedfordshire and descendants in Romford,
Essex.
-------------------------------
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the message
Which volume of TEAS?

-------------------------------
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Johnny Brananas
2013-04-19 00:11:09 UTC
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Raw Message
Page (144) in this source is a pedigree chart showing:

Robert Dawges [of Loughton, Essex], ob. 1619 circa

[son] Robert Dawges, aet. 15 in 1619; bur. at Loughton, Nov. 23, 1683
= Elizabeth ..., mar. secondly, ... Reave, ob. [? 1689] circa.

[children] Robert Dawges and Sarah Dawges (m. John Eyre).

http://books.google.com/books?id=rAQVAAAAQAAJ&pg=PP160&dq=%22elizabeth+dawges%22

So, if you can figure out which Elizabeth ---- married Robert Dawges,
you'll probably have the identity of the second wife of John Reeve.
Johnny Brananas
2013-04-19 00:31:14 UTC
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Raw Message
Post by Johnny Brananas
So, if you can figure out which Elizabeth ---- married Robert Dawges,
you'll probably have the identity of the second wife of John Reeve.
Robert Dawgs of Lowton, Essex, gent., aged about 60, had a license to
marry Elizabeth Skipwith, widow, aged about 40, in July 1666.

http://books.google.com/books?id=iqwKAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA120&dq=elizabeth+skipwith+dawgs&hl=en&sa=X&ei=wo1wUbLNCIjm9AT6noHwDQ&ved=0CDIQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=elizabeth%20skipwith%20dawgs&f=false

Okay, this is all I can do. You get the picture ... more research is
needed on the Reeve family of Harlow and Havering at Bower, Essex.
Jane Alexander
2013-04-19 00:10:17 UTC
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Raw Message
Some supporting evidence for generations 12 - 16

12) Giles Daubeney and wife Eleanor de Wylyngton / Welyton / Wyllington

13) Joan Daubeneye / Dawbeny and her husband Lawrence Pabenham, knight (d.
1399)

14) Eleanor Pabenham and husband John Teringham / Tyringham

15) John Teringham


from
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/catalogue/displaycataloguedetails.asp?CATID=-2542805&CATLN=7&Highlight=,GILES,DAUBENEYE&accessmethod=0

Giles Daubeneye, knight, to settle one-third of the manor of Tottenham on
himself, Eleanor daughter of Henry de Welyton, and the heirs of their
bodies, with remainder to his own right heirs. Middlesex.

---


http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/catalogue/displaycataloguedetails.asp?CATID=-2542797&CATLN=7&Highlight=,GILES,DAUBENEYE&accessmethod=0

Giles Daubeneye, knight, to settle the manor of Kempston on himself,
Eleanor daughter of Henry de Welyton, and the heirs of their bodies, with
remainder to his own right heirs. ...
----
Memorial brass at St Peter's Church, Offord Darcy - showing Sir Lawrence
Pabenham with two wives. Inscription says that second wife is Joan the
daughter of Sir Giles Daubeney.

Loading Image...

-------
http://sdrc.lib.uiowa.edu/patentrolls/h5v2/body/Henry5vol2page0399.pdf
Patent Rolls
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n***@gmail.com
2013-04-25 18:27:48 UTC
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Post by Jane Alexander
I am submitting the following line of descent to the forum for help in
confirming or refuting the following line of descent from William the
Conqueror to Susanna Reeve, who immigrated to Virginia and married Gillee
Gromarrin. Gillee Gromarrin was a major land holder in Henrico County,
Virginia. Gillee’s will is dated 16 Oct 1716, and probated 5 Nov 1716.
Thank you for your assistance,
Jane A. "Xan" Alexander
Line of Descent from William the Conqueror to Eleanor Pabenham to Susanna
Reeve
1) William the Conqueror (abt 1028 – 9 Sept 1087) and wife Matilda of
Flanders (abt 1031 – 2 Nov 1083)
2) King Henry I of England (abt 1068 – 1 Dec 1135) and mistress
3) Robert FitzRoy, Earl of Gloucester (d. 31 Oct 1147) & wife Mabel,
Countess of Gloucester (1090 – 29 Sept 1157)
4) Maud FitzRobert (d. 29 July 1189) & Ranulf de Gernon, Earl of Chester (
1099 – 1153)
5) Hugh de Kevelioc, Earl of Chester ( 1147 – 30 Jun 1181) and first wife
6) Amice / Amicia of Chester and husband Ralph de Mainwaring
7) Bertrad de Mainwaring and husband Henry de Audley (d. bef Nov 1246)
8) Alice de Audley and husband Peter / Piers de Montfort (d. 4 Aug 1265)
9) Piers / Peter II de Montfort and wife Matilda de la Mare
10) Elizabeth de Montfort and husband William de Montagu / Monte Acuto /
Montacute
11) Alice Montacute and husband Ralph Daubeney
12) Giles Daubeney and wife Eleanor de Wylyngton / Welyton / Wyllington
13) Joan Daubeneye / Dawbeny and her husband Lawrence Pabenham, knight (d.
1399)
14) Eleanor Pabenham and husband John Teringham / Tyringham
15) John Teringham & daughter of Sir Geoffrey Lucy (from Visitation of
Suffolk)
16) younger son Teringham & daughter of Sir William Chamberleyn (from
Visitation of Suffolk)
17) Teringham & daughter of Bardwell (from Visitation of Suffolk)
18) Mary Teringham and husband John Heigham (from Visitation of Suffolk –
Heigham family)
19) Elizabeth Heigham and husband Thomas Armiger (from Visitation of
Suffolk – Heigham family & Armiger family)
20) Thomas Armiger & wife Jane Eyre (from Visitation of Suffolk – Armiger
family)
21) Rose / Rhose Armiger & husband William Reve, gent. (from Visitation of
Essex – Reve family)
There may be one more Thomas Armiger generation between gen 20 & 21
22) Robert Reve, parson of Wrestlingworth
23) Robert Reve of Romford
24) John Reeve
25) Susanna Reeve immigrated to Virginia along with brother Francis Reeve.
She married Gillee Gromarrin. She is listed in her father John Reeve’s
will and in her brother Wiltshire Reeve’s will.
*Supporting Evidence: *
The will of “John Reeve of the parish of havering Lee Bower in the Countie
of Essex Gentleman” is dated 7 Nov 1693. In his will, he lists the
following children: Wiltshier, Francis, Susana, Ann, and Letitia.
(Susanna’s brother) Wiltshire Reeve’s will is published in The New York
Genealogical and Biographical Record, Volume 43, pages 69-70. The will of
“Wiltshire Reeve the elder, of Hubbard’s Hall in the parish of Harlow, co.
Essex, gent.” is dated 13 Sept 1704, proved 1 Dec 1707, and includes “also
I doe give and devise all my plantations, lands, tenements, etc. at or neer
James River or elsewhere in Virginia in the parts beyond the seas, unto my
sister Susan, now Susan Mareen, now or late residing in Virginia, and to
her heirs for ever.” Wiltshire also lists his sisters Letitia Wickstead
and Anne Spademan.
From Tidewater Virginia Families: A Magazine of History and Genealogy,
"*1 Aug 1698 Francis Reeve (II) signs a pledge to give an annuity of 10
pounds for every year after 1703 during the life of Susannah Marrin, which
was give to her by her decd father, John Reeve, and to pay 90 pounds to
her on Oct 31 1703; if she dies before 1703, Gilly Grooma Marrin will
release him from payment. (footnote: Weisiger, Henrico Deeds, (1):104."
From the Visitation of Essex – Reve family: John Reeve’s great uncle
Francis Reve owned Hubbard Hall, thus tieing Susana’s brother Wiltshire
Reve to the Reve family given in the Visitation.
Visitation of Essex – Reve family
http://archive.org/stream/visitationsofess1314metc#page/274/mode/2up<http://archive.org/stream/visitationsofess1314metc%22%20%5Cl%20%22page/274/mode/2up>-
1612
http://archive.org/stream/visitationsofess1314metc#page/476/mode/2up<http://archive.org/stream/visitationsofess1314metc%22%20%5Cl%20%22page/476/mode/2up>-
1634
Visitation of Suffolk
http://archive.org/stream/visitationsofsuf00harvuoft#page/108/mode/2up<http://archive.org/stream/visitationsofsuf00harvuoft%22%20%5Cl%20%22page/108/mode/2up>-
Armiger family
Visitation of Suffolk part 2
http://books.google.com/books?id=6BoaAAAAIAAJ&pg=PA212#v=onepage&q&f=false<http://books.google.com/books?id=6BoaAAAAIAAJ&pg=PA212%22%20%5Cl%20%22v=onepage&q&f=false>
- Heigham Pedigree, including Teringham back to Pabenham, also lists
Elizabeth, daughter of John Heigham & Mary Teringham, married to Thomas
Armiger
Hi Jane et al --

I work at the Family History Library and would be happy spend a reasonable amount of time (for free) to look up any documents for you we may have to document this lineage.

Nathan W. Murphy, MA, AG
Senior Research Consultant
Family History Library
Salt Lake City, Utah
n***@gmail.com
2013-04-29 20:06:11 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
I attempted to locate this family in Havering parish registers. Havering's seventeenth-century parish registers are not available at the Family History Library. They have been digitized at SEAX (subscription site) http://seax.essexcc.gov.uk/Result_Details.aspx?ID=34174; the earliest year of baptisms is 1657 and the earliest year of marriages is 1696

I checked Boyd's Marriage Index for John Reeve's marriage to Elizabeth, and pinpointed it at Loughton, Essex:

1683 Nov 22 John Reeve & Elisabeth Dawges at Loughton, Essex (FHL British Film 560907 Item 1)
wjhonson
2018-07-05 00:53:47 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by Jane Alexander
I am submitting the following line of descent to the forum for help in
confirming or refuting the following line of descent from William the
Conqueror to Susanna Reeve, who immigrated to Virginia and married Gillee
Gromarrin. Gillee Gromarrin was a major land holder in Henrico County,
Virginia. Gillee’s will is dated 16 Oct 1716, and probated 5 Nov 1716.
Thank you for your assistance,
Jane A. "Xan" Alexander
Line of Descent from William the Conqueror to Eleanor Pabenham to Susanna
Reeve
1) William the Conqueror (abt 1028 – 9 Sept 1087) and wife Matilda of
Flanders (abt 1031 – 2 Nov 1083)
2) King Henry I of England (abt 1068 – 1 Dec 1135) and mistress
3) Robert FitzRoy, Earl of Gloucester (d. 31 Oct 1147) & wife Mabel,
Countess of Gloucester (1090 – 29 Sept 1157)
4) Maud FitzRobert (d. 29 July 1189) & Ranulf de Gernon, Earl of Chester (
1099 – 1153)
5) Hugh de Kevelioc, Earl of Chester ( 1147 – 30 Jun 1181) and first wife
6) Amice / Amicia of Chester and husband Ralph de Mainwaring
7) Bertrad de Mainwaring and husband Henry de Audley (d. bef Nov 1246)
8) Alice de Audley and husband Peter / Piers de Montfort (d. 4 Aug 1265)
9) Piers / Peter II de Montfort and wife Matilda de la Mare
10) Elizabeth de Montfort and husband William de Montagu / Monte Acuto /
Montacute
11) Alice Montacute and husband Ralph Daubeney
12) Giles Daubeney and wife Eleanor de Wylyngton / Welyton / Wyllington
13) Joan Daubeneye / Dawbeny and her husband Lawrence Pabenham, knight (d.
1399)
14) Eleanor Pabenham and husband John Teringham / Tyringham
15) John Teringham & daughter of Sir Geoffrey Lucy (from Visitation of
Suffolk)
16) younger son Teringham & daughter of Sir William Chamberleyn (from
Visitation of Suffolk)
17) Teringham & daughter of Bardwell (from Visitation of Suffolk)
18) Mary Teringham and husband John Heigham (from Visitation of Suffolk –
Heigham family)
19) Elizabeth Heigham and husband Thomas Armiger (from Visitation of
Suffolk – Heigham family & Armiger family)
20) Thomas Armiger & wife Jane Eyre (from Visitation of Suffolk – Armiger
family)
21) Rose / Rhose Armiger & husband William Reve, gent. (from Visitation of
Essex – Reve family)
There may be one more Thomas Armiger generation between gen 20 & 21
22) Robert Reve, parson of Wrestlingworth
23) Robert Reve of Romford
24) John Reeve
25) Susanna Reeve immigrated to Virginia along with brother Francis Reeve.
She married Gillee Gromarrin. She is listed in her father John Reeve’s
will and in her brother Wiltshire Reeve’s will.
*Supporting Evidence: *
The will of “John Reeve of the parish of havering Lee Bower in the Countie
of Essex Gentleman” is dated 7 Nov 1693. In his will, he lists the
following children: Wiltshier, Francis, Susana, Ann, and Letitia.
(Susanna’s brother) Wiltshire Reeve’s will is published in The New York
Genealogical and Biographical Record, Volume 43, pages 69-70. The will of
“Wiltshire Reeve the elder, of Hubbard’s Hall in the parish of Harlow, co.
Essex, gent.” is dated 13 Sept 1704, proved 1 Dec 1707, and includes “also
I doe give and devise all my plantations, lands, tenements, etc. at or neer
James River or elsewhere in Virginia in the parts beyond the seas, unto my
sister Susan, now Susan Mareen, now or late residing in Virginia, and to
her heirs for ever.” Wiltshire also lists his sisters Letitia Wickstead
and Anne Spademan.
From Tidewater Virginia Families: A Magazine of History and Genealogy,
"*1 Aug 1698 Francis Reeve (II) signs a pledge to give an annuity of 10
pounds for every year after 1703 during the life of Susannah Marrin, which
was give to her by her decd father, John Reeve, and to pay 90 pounds to
her on Oct 31 1703; if she dies before 1703, Gilly Grooma Marrin will
release him from payment. (footnote: Weisiger, Henrico Deeds, (1):104."
From the Visitation of Essex – Reve family: John Reeve’s great uncle
Francis Reve owned Hubbard Hall, thus tieing Susana’s brother Wiltshire
Reve to the Reve family given in the Visitation.
Visitation of Essex – Reve family
http://archive.org/stream/visitationsofess1314metc#page/274/mode/2up<http://archive.org/stream/visitationsofess1314metc%22%20%5Cl%20%22page/274/mode/2up>-
1612
http://archive.org/stream/visitationsofess1314metc#page/476/mode/2up<http://archive.org/stream/visitationsofess1314metc%22%20%5Cl%20%22page/476/mode/2up>-
1634
Visitation of Suffolk
http://archive.org/stream/visitationsofsuf00harvuoft#page/108/mode/2up<http://archive.org/stream/visitationsofsuf00harvuoft%22%20%5Cl%20%22page/108/mode/2up>-
Armiger family
Visitation of Suffolk part 2
http://books.google.com/books?id=6BoaAAAAIAAJ&pg=PA212#v=onepage&q&f=false<http://books.google.com/books?id=6BoaAAAAIAAJ&pg=PA212%22%20%5Cl%20%22v=onepage&q&f=false>
- Heigham Pedigree, including Teringham back to Pabenham, also lists
Elizabeth, daughter of John Heigham & Mary Teringham, married to Thomas
Armiger
There is something wrong in this descent
The Tirringham line should be

John Tirringham, adult 1381-2 when Knight of the Shire; by his wife Isabel Weston had

John Tirringham, who married Catherine Lucy and had

John Tirringham who married Eleanor Pabenham and had

John Tirringham who married Alice Olney and had

John Tirringham who married Elizabeth Brudenell
wjhonson
2018-07-05 02:03:15 UTC
Permalink
Raw Message
Post by wjhonson
Post by Jane Alexander
I am submitting the following line of descent to the forum for help in
confirming or refuting the following line of descent from William the
Conqueror to Susanna Reeve, who immigrated to Virginia and married Gillee
Gromarrin. Gillee Gromarrin was a major land holder in Henrico County,
Virginia. Gillee’s will is dated 16 Oct 1716, and probated 5 Nov 1716.
Thank you for your assistance,
Jane A. "Xan" Alexander
Line of Descent from William the Conqueror to Eleanor Pabenham to Susanna
Reeve
1) William the Conqueror (abt 1028 – 9 Sept 1087) and wife Matilda of
Flanders (abt 1031 – 2 Nov 1083)
2) King Henry I of England (abt 1068 – 1 Dec 1135) and mistress
3) Robert FitzRoy, Earl of Gloucester (d. 31 Oct 1147) & wife Mabel,
Countess of Gloucester (1090 – 29 Sept 1157)
4) Maud FitzRobert (d. 29 July 1189) & Ranulf de Gernon, Earl of Chester (
1099 – 1153)
5) Hugh de Kevelioc, Earl of Chester ( 1147 – 30 Jun 1181) and first wife
6) Amice / Amicia of Chester and husband Ralph de Mainwaring
7) Bertrad de Mainwaring and husband Henry de Audley (d. bef Nov 1246)
8) Alice de Audley and husband Peter / Piers de Montfort (d. 4 Aug 1265)
9) Piers / Peter II de Montfort and wife Matilda de la Mare
10) Elizabeth de Montfort and husband William de Montagu / Monte Acuto /
Montacute
11) Alice Montacute and husband Ralph Daubeney
12) Giles Daubeney and wife Eleanor de Wylyngton / Welyton / Wyllington
13) Joan Daubeneye / Dawbeny and her husband Lawrence Pabenham, knight (d.
1399)
14) Eleanor Pabenham and husband John Teringham / Tyringham
15) John Teringham & daughter of Sir Geoffrey Lucy (from Visitation of
Suffolk)
16) younger son Teringham & daughter of Sir William Chamberleyn (from
Visitation of Suffolk)
17) Teringham & daughter of Bardwell (from Visitation of Suffolk)
18) Mary Teringham and husband John Heigham (from Visitation of Suffolk –
Heigham family)
19) Elizabeth Heigham and husband Thomas Armiger (from Visitation of
Suffolk – Heigham family & Armiger family)
20) Thomas Armiger & wife Jane Eyre (from Visitation of Suffolk – Armiger
family)
21) Rose / Rhose Armiger & husband William Reve, gent. (from Visitation of
Essex – Reve family)
There may be one more Thomas Armiger generation between gen 20 & 21
22) Robert Reve, parson of Wrestlingworth
23) Robert Reve of Romford
24) John Reeve
25) Susanna Reeve immigrated to Virginia along with brother Francis Reeve.
She married Gillee Gromarrin. She is listed in her father John Reeve’s
will and in her brother Wiltshire Reeve’s will.
*Supporting Evidence: *
The will of “John Reeve of the parish of havering Lee Bower in the Countie
of Essex Gentleman” is dated 7 Nov 1693. In his will, he lists the
following children: Wiltshier, Francis, Susana, Ann, and Letitia.
(Susanna’s brother) Wiltshire Reeve’s will is published in The New York
Genealogical and Biographical Record, Volume 43, pages 69-70. The will of
“Wiltshire Reeve the elder, of Hubbard’s Hall in the parish of Harlow, co.
Essex, gent.” is dated 13 Sept 1704, proved 1 Dec 1707, and includes “also
I doe give and devise all my plantations, lands, tenements, etc. at or neer
James River or elsewhere in Virginia in the parts beyond the seas, unto my
sister Susan, now Susan Mareen, now or late residing in Virginia, and to
her heirs for ever.” Wiltshire also lists his sisters Letitia Wickstead
and Anne Spademan.
From Tidewater Virginia Families: A Magazine of History and Genealogy,
"*1 Aug 1698 Francis Reeve (II) signs a pledge to give an annuity of 10
pounds for every year after 1703 during the life of Susannah Marrin, which
was give to her by her decd father, John Reeve, and to pay 90 pounds to
her on Oct 31 1703; if she dies before 1703, Gilly Grooma Marrin will
release him from payment. (footnote: Weisiger, Henrico Deeds, (1):104."
From the Visitation of Essex – Reve family: John Reeve’s great uncle
Francis Reve owned Hubbard Hall, thus tieing Susana’s brother Wiltshire
Reve to the Reve family given in the Visitation.
Visitation of Essex – Reve family
http://archive.org/stream/visitationsofess1314metc#page/274/mode/2up<http://archive.org/stream/visitationsofess1314metc%22%20%5Cl%20%22page/274/mode/2up>-
1612
http://archive.org/stream/visitationsofess1314metc#page/476/mode/2up<http://archive.org/stream/visitationsofess1314metc%22%20%5Cl%20%22page/476/mode/2up>-
1634
Visitation of Suffolk
http://archive.org/stream/visitationsofsuf00harvuoft#page/108/mode/2up<http://archive.org/stream/visitationsofsuf00harvuoft%22%20%5Cl%20%22page/108/mode/2up>-
Armiger family
Visitation of Suffolk part 2
http://books.google.com/books?id=6BoaAAAAIAAJ&pg=PA212#v=onepage&q&f=false<http://books.google.com/books?id=6BoaAAAAIAAJ&pg=PA212%22%20%5Cl%20%22v=onepage&q&f=false>
- Heigham Pedigree, including Teringham back to Pabenham, also lists
Elizabeth, daughter of John Heigham & Mary Teringham, married to Thomas
Armiger
There is something wrong in this descent
The Tirringham line should be
John Tirringham, adult 1381-2 when Knight of the Shire; by his wife Isabel Weston had
John Tirringham, who married Catherine Lucy and had
John Tirringham who married Eleanor Pabenham and had
John Tirringham who married Alice Olney and had
John Tirringham who married Elizabeth Brudenell
Because of this, your descent loses the royal ascent to Henry I

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